TPM MAIN SITE REVIVAL PROJECT!

[Charles Legend]

How about Squirtle Ho-oh, and Lucario?

Squitle do to the fact not only it a fist gen pokemon, kevin has an Avatar of one, that and it is a lot more useful in Brawl then ether Ivysaur or Charizard...

Ho_oh because not only for the phoenix reference, and a partial throwback to the old Mewtwo/Lugia/Ho-oh logo, but it's by far one of the more known second gen pokemon besides it being a legendary under lines the fact that TPM iself is some what of a legendary pokemon fansite.

Lucario he replaced Mewtwo in Brawl, is easily one of the most popular Pokemon, and People thought he was a legendary, but of course there is a legend about Lucario..that and he was most likely based off of Anubis since he looks like a jackle waling on two legs.

~Charles Legend

[Jeff]

I'm not sure if admins themselves can create forums, or super mods or what. We could I guess use the pokemasters.net forum. But I think a new forum with access granted to members known. Ie. just make it so you either must be registered to view the forum so we got no randoms looking in. Or even going further than that and granting it to members known to everyone else. Ie. No random new person with 1 post by his name able to access the forum.

In that forum, could be a post for the locatordex, a post for the pokedex, a post for natures, a post for diamond/pearl Gym Leaders, a post fixing up a section in Gold/Silver/Crystal. That way we can see what people are working on. But also edit things or point out areas that may need to be elaborated on, changed or fixed. That way content is getting done and people are posting real things down and others can review what people have posted and the like.

I think this is a good idea, I'm working on a site layout and it'd be nice to have somewhere to share it with other people working on the project.

[Jeff]

OK, here's the layout I mentioned in my last post. It's still far from complete, but I thought I'd show people what I came up with and get some input on it.

[DarkestLight]

I like the approach so far Jeff , and I'm sure that of course there will be much more to add....

This is just a standard nitpick. Every site in the world has that layout. Can't fault what works, I'm just always noticing the side column on the left side, and then the spaced center and right areas for bulletins/snippets/what have you. It just..works.

Again, Your base layout is great, and I'm sure we can work with that very much :O. Maybe have the banner (the new banner?) NOT be a rectangle persay, but like, get a tad thicker toward the right side, so it has a more fluid look to it? But that's just cosmetic...doesnt change the layout any.

Ima..shush now.

[Jeff]

I don't think the "getting thicker towards the right" thing is even possible. Whether the site is laid out with tables or CSS (I used CSS), everything's a box.

As for the layout, the sidebar layout got the most votes in the poll so that's what I went with when I started designing this concept. It makes sense to me, like you said, it works. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[Number1ChanseyFan]

Hmmm, I guess I am a little bit nostalgic, but what about bringing back the old Mewtwo/Lugia/Ho-oh logo for the forums section? And as for the actual website, didn't we used to have different pictures and Pokemon for different times of the year? I think something like that would be nice.

[Dark Scizor]

Oh wow. I like it. Just for the nostalgia if nothing else.

[mr_pikachu]

Jeff and I have already discussed layout ideas a bit, and I can honestly say I like his creation a bit better than my original draft. For comparison, here's a screenshot of the original.

For the record, I think we need to get some idea on the layout as soon as possible. That way we can devote our focus to obtaining and organizing the data. It's especially crucial since we already have quite a bit of the necessary info.

[Drago]

At this time, I believe I prefer Jeff's layout. The sidebar looks pretty slick, maybe the headings could be a mite bit fancier though - textures and the like - pardon my lack of Interwebs knowledge.

Additionally, the links are alligned a bit low to the Pokeballs, but I'd think that's less a layout matter, more just a bit of tweaking. Anyhow, it's looking good! I'll keep observing and throwing in a couple thoughts as they come to me.

EDIT: One our last layouts had a member login sidebar off to the right... It kinda closes things in nicely I feel, though some may not like the amount of vertical space it then makes in the middle. Brian mentioned, if editing privileges go to non-admins, a login bar might be required.

Additionally, I may be alone on this but I like the blue headbar/white background style, and think it could be incorporated into the headlines, as well. I guess I just kinda like the 'closed off' look of having the text in a different scheme from the background.

[mr_pikachu]

I sort of concur with Tony in that certain aspects of the color scheme probably need to be changed if we go with Jeff's layout. Personally, though, I'd be fine with just lightening the shade of the main section to one of the grays in our forum layout, just so we don't have such a contrast between the sidebar and a pure black background.

I liked the use of "Dexter" as a primary heading in the sidebar, though. Very nice. The sidebar as a whole rocks (aside from the Pokeball thing Tony mentioned); it just clashes a little with the black background, in my opinion.

What does everyone else think?

[firepokemon]

I can't offer much to the layout. Overall its pleasing, once we get a picture or two. The only thing is we're going to offer a substantial news service and yet because we have so much to do we'll be having dozens of website updates. I'm just curious if there is space in the current design for that. As for the countdown. I would prefer to see moved to the right side since its kinda in your face at the moment. Overall, though its pleasing.

Though we'd need to get our sections sorted a bit more. I like that fanworks and the forums are first, then we have the pokedex, locatordex and the like next. Then the games. Just wondering whether in future when or if we have articles, columns, anime and the like whether there will be the room for them.

Anyway I see the forums have been slightly changed with Other Pokemon Games being made an archive forum. Any news about whether a forum for site updates is being made, has it even been discussed? Since the pokedex and locatordex compiling of data is going to take alot and lots of work. And more work than I think anyone currently realises. I'm just curious since I haven't really read any thoughts about it except by Jeff.

Also rather curious when you say we have a lot of the necessary information already. Since as far as I know we only have some anime data. Unless other things are taking shape behind the scenes?

[Mikachu Yukitatsu]

Just talking about myself, this is quite irrevelant while you others discuss layouts and such...

Mikachu: Many thanks for the offer, Mikachu! You rock. That will be unique content that no one else will have... always a plus. ^_^

Perhaps putting a vocabulary linked to each translation isn't a good idea, but what do yo think of my previous post? And now, the following link goes to Spoilers forum. I don't
know if I rock after you have read this, but...

http://www.pokemasters.net/forums/sh...869#post373869

[mr_pikachu]

Sorry, apparently I wasn't very clear about us "having the information already." I was referring to your long post on page two of this thread; specifically, the archived pages on the games and such. We do have a significant amount of the episode listing done, though, and it appears that we also have two good initial ideas for the layout.

I think what we may want to do is figure out which layout everyone prefers, then make tweaks to that one while adding content. That seems to be the logical next step, to me at least.

Regarding a separate forum being made for the 'dex stuff, I have not yet approached the admins about that. My computer was actually cripplingly hacked a couple of days ago, so I spent most of my weekend backing up my data and wiping it. Sorry for the delay, but I couldn't even get online for awhile.

I agree with you that they'll take tons of work in comparison with everything else. It may end up being the last thing we finish before we post the site. (On that note, should we prioritize information on RSEDPP and work backwards? If we do, we might be able to afford having the 'dexes only partially complete on launch... as long as the new information is there, we may be fine.)

As for subsections under the main sections, I think there are a few ways in which we could handle that. One would be to have a drop-down menu when you entered an individual section... say, for instance, you entered the RBY section. On the sidebar, there might be additional indented links to "Walkthrough," "Attacks," "Items," etc.

Alternatively, we could do it like this archived page and just give the path above the content (i.e. Pokemasters / Red & Blue / Walkthough).

Your suggestion on the countdown sounds a little like how this layout worked. We should probably keep it higher on the right side if we do that, but it's clear that that structure does work.

(Other Pokemon Games, by the way, still exists. Online Pokemon Battling is the one that was archived.)



Mikachu: It's an interesting angle. I think we should probably keep our audience in mind, though. I'm not sure we'll get many visitors who rely on Japanese and can't speak English, so full summaries in Japanese probably aren't necessary. For the people who may want to have Japanese episode titles on hand, however, I have compiled a list of them through about nine-and-a-half seasons (plus Chronicles and the movies).



Okay. For now, are there any objections to picking one of the two layouts and working with it?

[Jeff]

Obviously I'd be a bit biased as to which layout to use . Anyway, I've been tweaking the page a bit. So far I've fixed the Pokeball issue and started a login bar. Thanks for the input everyone, I'll try playing around with some of the other suggestions tomorrow.

[firepokemon]

Eh hold on. In regards to the logn page for people who can update etc.That can be handled without that being visible to others. Ie. at the back end. Where that login piece could work is if the like last website we allowed others to comment on news and updates. Which I think is something we should welcome.

[mr_pikachu]

Eh hold on. In regards to the logn page for people who can update etc.That can be handled without that being visible to others. Ie. at the back end. Where that login piece could work is if the like last website we allowed others to comment on news and updates. Which I think is something we should welcome.

Precisely. I agree that there needs to be some sort of backdoor for actual updates. Comments, on the other hand, could use a login bar. The same goes if we have something like the earlier blog suggestion or a team creator (though the latter is probably doable without a login, now that I think about it).


Jeff: I'm biased, and I prefer yours anyway. The aesthetics are much better in my opinion.


Everyone else: Shall we pick a layout?

[Mikachu Yukitatsu]

Mikachu: It's an interesting angle. I think we should probably keep our audience in mind, though. I'm not sure we'll get many visitors who rely on Japanese and can't speak English, so full summaries in Japanese probably aren't necessary. For the people who may want to have Japanese episode titles on hand, however, I have compiled a list of them through about nine-and-a-half seasons (plus Chronicles and the movies).

I got it, but where do you get the English translations for the titles from? But it's just that I don't rely on my own translations, and I think it would be good to have the original Japanese kana/kanji AND romaji to back me up. Tv Tokyo doesn't have romaji in its page anyway, so this could be something we'd have as an advantage, I think.

What about the Team Rocket mottos and vocabularies I talked about earlier? I found some printed pages from my collection and I'm considering posting them at Pokemon Anime.

Again, just my own thoughts, not related to the matters mostly discussed here...

[firepokemon]

Go with Jeffs as long as there are some amendments.

[mr_pikachu]

I got it, but where do you get the English translations for the titles from?

You know... now that I think about it, I actually don't remember. It's been quite a long time since I started the original draft... maybe a year ago. I'll have to look through some of my information and see if I can figure out where I obtained it. We'll need the newer episode titles if we continue along that route, after all.

As for the mottos and such, I think that could be something we feature. Not sure exactly where we'd put it... maybe as kind of a worldwide area under the anime section? It's something to discuss.


fp: Just to be clear, we'll undoubtedly make some changes to whichever layout we use. The key is figuring out our starting point. It'll be easier to make changes quickly once we have an initial layout. (That will also make organizing content much, much simpler.)


I'll start trying to get some information from the archives and organize it. That way, we can spend more time focusing on other, more important tasks.

[firepokemon]

Yes in regards to the anime, eventually one could begin to explore more canon type things and areas such as mottos and the like. Be interested in that myself.

I've been going through the archives myself Mr. Pikachu, just have a looking at everything, noting a few things, some things to be expanded on and the like. One thing I have noticed is that some links are missing in the walkthrus for RBY and GSC. These give extra information and help for those walkthrus. I don't think one should be too worried about. I wouldn't even fix them up at this stage. Just something to note and to clear up at some stage.

Also of note for RBY at least. Haven't checked GSC, is that for items and HM/TMs list many of those link to the actual walkthru. Just something that should be noted.

Have we clarified as to what things we'll specifically work on for the debut of the site?

As for me in general, at this stage not doing anything substantial. Just exploring things, thinking about things. But when the time is ready, happy to help compile data and the like. Am looking forward to any discussions of some type of private forum for the compiling and writing down of specific pages and that so they can be commented on and edited etc etc.

[mr_pikachu]

I don't think we yet determined exactly what will be developed first. I did note, however, that pretty much everyone mentioned the Locatordex in their list of five things, so that definitely becomes a priority. (That's the reason I asked people to do that.) Aside from that, it seemed to be mostly basic information across the spectrum of the games. That leads me to believe we should go for standard information (much like what we had on previous sites) as a starting point. That can be our initial direction, if not a step-by-step plan.

If we have some people who want to work on other things as well (haven't heard too much about fanworks in the last few days, but that's something we'll eventually want to cover, I think... the translations are a good idea, too), then those plans can probably be included. I'm fine with casting a wide net, if that's what people want. But the things that most people mentioned in their lists should probably take precedence for the rest of us, at least at the start.

[Mikachu Yukitatsu]

The format I've used for mottos and such, has been BB code so far because I'm most familiar with it and then I can post it here in the forums first. But should I do HTML or something? I've had one HTML and Internet course when I was still at school and can't say I know much.

Edit: And by the way, what will the international section look like if there is just Finnish stuff?

[firepokemon]

Yes so far the one thing noticed by most people have been the locatordex.

I can start compiling some of the data for each route etc in each game. I presume start with a map of RBY, map of Ruby and Sapphire. Maybe a separate map for Emerald. One for FireRed and Leafgreen and then one for Pearl, Diamond and Platinum??? Those are obvious. I don't know much about XD or anything do they have maps and the like? Even if they do, if we just focus on the main handheld games for each generation would likely be the best thing to do.

Edit: Just to clarify. This won't be actual HTML code or anything. Just simply going through each route, underground etc for each game and typing up the pokemon there what percentage they are, a note if a DS insert is necessary or if they're a swarm pokemon etc.

[mr_pikachu]

Mikachu: I wouldn't worry too much about the format. If you've got the information, the people who are more familiar with HTML can handle the coding. ^^


fp: Well, I was thinking we might want to take a present-back approach, starting with the fourth generation and working backwards. Starting with the newest games would probably help us cater to a wider audience. And the handheld games should probably take precedence; Colosseum and XD can come later. (They were third-gen anyway, so we likely won't have as many visitors looking for that information.)

EDIT: See my note to Mikachu.

[firepokemon]

Yes that makes sense.

So I'll make sure to compile data for D/P/Platinum. I can do RSEFRLG. And I want to see RBY and GSC and maps for those are easy to get hold of. So I'll just start compiling some data for each of those generations. And sorry but like Mikachu I don't have much experience in HTML coding and the rest. So that isn't an area I can help in. Compiling data is always important and necessary and that is something I can offer.

[mr_pikachu]

And I want to see RBY and GSC and maps for those are easy to get hold of.

Try this map, at least for starters.

[firepokemon]

Yeah that map would be perfect for whoever will do the actual HTML coding or whatever programming language. And I can pretty much use that map for each route and the like. So yes do RBY first. I'll just do sorta what I was thinking in the first place. Then I'll post it and people can edit it, change it, say what they don't want. Add whatever and see what happens from there/

[Mikachu Yukitatsu]

Edit: And by the way, what will the international section look like if there is just Finnish stuff?

I'm sorry to bother you again with this, but in case I was ignored. So I know only one Swedish and one Japanese motto plus less than 10 Finnish ones. It will be one-sided if there's just me to post. But the following little Finnish-only stuff only I can produce, would be fun, I think, taken from one of my General Discussion topics:

Johto = a Finnish word meaning 'lead' (as a noun based on the werb 'to lead', 'johtaa'). Pronouned quite differently from Japanese 'jouto/jooto'.

Kanto = a Finnish word meaning 'tree stump'. I think it is pronunciated with two os in Japanese though.

Pika = a suffix in Finnish language, meaning 'fast' or 'quick', for example, 'pikaruoka' = 'fast food', 'ruoka' being the word for 'food'.

Paras = a Finnish word meaning 'the best'.

Minun = a Finnish word form meaning 'my, mine', the stem being 'minä'.

So you can say like this in Finnish:

Ash johtaa Johto-Liigaa.
Ash leads the Johto League.

Paras on paras!
Paras is the best!

Minun Minunini!
My Minun!

Tuo Minun on minun!
That Minun is mine!

Tässä ovat Minun, Paras, ja minun paras Pokémonini, Parasect!
Here are Minun, Paras and my best Pokémon, Parasect!

[mr_pikachu]

Ah, the stealthy edits elude me once more.

Well, to refer back to a previous comment I made on the subject... I don't really know yet how a "worldwide" page would look. I doubt we'd limit it to Finnish information, though; it seems only fitting to have some Japanese stuff if we go that route. Heck, I've already collected tidbits of episode data, myself, so we could get something together.

But I'm really not sure exactly how it would emerge or what information it would host... right now, I just don't have a better answer than to say we need to discuss it. Anyway, it's not my decision to make, but everyone's.


Side note: I'm doing a bit of work on the attackdex right now... it's tedious, but worth it.

[Jeff]

I've already started working on the maps. I have a GSC map to use, and thanks to the link to the RBY one, I should be able to do them all now. I have the actual map images done for Hoenn and Sinnoh, and the Hoenn map is already coded, I just need to get it into the TPM format, which I'm still working on.

[Mikachu Yukitatsu]

http://www.pokemasters.net/forums/sh...110#post374110

I did also this. The first post contains all the mottos I was able to find.

[Jeff]

There's the revised layout. The biggest changes are the new bar on the right and the lighter background. There are also, of course, some minor tweaks like the pokeball fix I mentioned before.

Regarding fp's comments way up the page, I wouldn't worry about there not being enough room for things; new features can always be added to the sidebar, which will stretch to accommodate them. As for squeezing in all the updates. In the early days we could have a single announcement posted that will list all the latest features, then after the onslaught of initial features dies down we can post individual announcements for each feature.

[mr_pikachu]

This just continues to get cooler. Alright, um... one small tweak: could you make the top and bottom of the page (pure black) match the discussion area) dark gray)? I think that would make it look more cohesive and help the announcements stand out even more with the contrast.

And another really, really small thought... do you think we should make the thin blue borders on the left and right of the announcements match in terms of width? Or is it better like that for the effect?

Otherwise, this is looking awesome. I like the availability of comments, too... I assume the blue "Comments: 3" sections are links to make them viewable? Fantastic stuff you've developed here, man.

[Jeff]

Like I said before, but I'll say it here for everyone else, the Pokemasters logo that I've been using has a black background, which is why I had to use a black background for the page. I'll likely do alot more tweaking once I get some of the images we're going to use.

I didn't think about the borders, it made sense to have them off balance when there was only content to one side of the main area, but now that the page is more balanced, it makes sense to balance the borders too.

As for the comments, yeah, I'm just not sure how we'll do it. I'd prefer them going to a separate page where someone can view/post comments on the story, but having them on the main page and making them visible when the link is clicked is another option.

[Andrew]

Jeff, my main issues are:

1) It looks far too much like Serebii.
2) The Left Sidebar should be skinnier.

Also, I suggest we use creative commons. It's a much more advantageous avenue than copywrite. And it can help us more, should nintendo ever want to shut us down.

[RedStarWarrior]

Jeff, my main issues are:

1) It looks far too much like Serebii.
2) The Left Sidebar should be skinnier.

Also, I suggest we use creative commons. It's a much more advantageous avenue than copywrite. And it can help us more, should nintendo ever want to shut us down.

The farther from Serebii, the better.

Anyway, I can help if needed for anything. I can do web design and graphics design (or I can be a simple editor for articles as I do have an English degree).

[firepokemon]

Jeff, my main issues are:

1) It looks far too much like Serebii.
2) The Left Sidebar should be skinnier.

Also, I suggest we use creative commons. It's a much more advantageous avenue than copywrite. And it can help us more, should nintendo ever want to shut us down.

Creative commons for what? Information?

[Dark Scizor]

Just make sure you guys keep it clean, simple and as clutter-free as you can.

[mr_pikachu]

Agreed. Simplicity is crucial.

So, we have some complaints about the site looking too similar to Serebii. How would you suggest we change the layout to distinguish it from theirs?

[Jeff]

I did a side-by side comparison this morning after reading Andrew's comment, and the one thing that stuck out at me as being similar is the lines between the news items. I'll try out some other ways to visually separate them, such as the boxes used in old TPM layouts.